Curse

Brian the Gladiator · Mar 24, 2011, 05:38 PM // 17:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by LifeInfusion

Ranger Interrupts require much more skill to use than Mesmer interrupts and they're less reliable. You can't interrupt 3/4 casts easily with ranger interrupts unless you anticipate/time it.

It's quite plausible to be interrupted by an arrow whizzing past your eye while casting... or simple choking gas ala World War I.

This comment is also patently false. Any PvPer (who actually knows game mechanics) will tell you that ranger interrupts have the exact same casting time as memser interrupts. D-Shot and Savage Shot have 1/4 second casting times despite the skill description that says 1/2. Also, Ranger interrupts absolutely do not require more skill to use. Ranger interrupts are far more forgiving than mesmer interrupts as their recharges are much lower and none of them are being used as energy management. Sorry, but this comment is just plain wrong.

Kelfer · Mar 24, 2011, 06:07 PM // 18:07

Quote:

Yes, Rangers could use some buffing.
No, they do not need a complete rework.

^ This.
/signed

And thanks to the ppl at A'net for removing my only suggestion on Wiki re Ranger:

DECREASE CASTING TIME OF TROLL UNGENT !!!

It has to be the single most redundant heal in the game !

You have to either use a stance to cover interrupt or run off and hide before casting, wth???? That's deadly in PvP.....

/rantover

LifeInfusion · Mar 24, 2011, 06:15 PM // 18:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian the Gladiator

This comment is also patently false. Any PvPer (who actually knows game mechanics) will tell you that ranger interrupts have the exact same casting time as memser interrupts. D-Shot and Savage Shot have 1/4 second casting times despite the skill description that says 1/2. Also, Ranger interrupts absolutely do not require more skill to use. Ranger interrupts are far more forgiving than mesmer interrupts as their recharges are much lower and none of them are being used as energy management. Sorry, but this comment is just plain wrong.

there's flight time. There's also block stances...

Kunder · Mar 24, 2011, 06:17 PM // 18:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by drkn

Interrupting with arrows just doesn't make sense. Logic-wise. Sure, you got used to rupting with rangers, it might be fun, but it just plainly sucks.
It'd be fine if they had 1-2 skills to rupt, one being Chocking Gas, with long recharges and some penalties, or being elites. Leave mesmers' niche for them or give them pets.

Magic just doesn't make sense. Logic-wise. Why the hell does a mesmer making a few motions cause an interrupt? Maybe you could distract me if a female mesmer took her top off mid battle, but otherwise I don't think there is any real reason for an interruption.

If you want to go with logic, every single attack from anything should interrupt. And Characters should have 20ish health while spells shouldn't exist. Damn, wouldn't rangers be powerful?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian the Gladiator

This comment is also patently false. Any PvPer (who actually knows game mechanics) will tell you that ranger interrupts have the exact same casting time as memser interrupts. D-Shot and Savage Shot have 1/4 second casting times despite the skill description that says 1/2. Also, Ranger interrupts absolutely do not require more skill to use. Ranger interrupts are far more forgiving than mesmer interrupts as their recharges are much lower and none of them are being used as energy management. Sorry, but this comment is just plain wrong.

There is this thing called arrow flight time. Maybe you would know about it if you actually played the game?

Lanier · Mar 24, 2011, 08:06 PM // 20:06

agreed that rangers dont need a complete rework, just a normal skill update. I also think that paragons are in more dire need of a skill update than rangers. I wouldn't mind rangers getting updated at the same time as paragons, but anet did say paragons would be next, and the paragon class is pretty pitiful at support (what its supposed to be good at...) when not running an imbagon build (which needs nerfing anyway).

aga · Mar 24, 2011, 08:24 PM // 20:24

Rangers are fine in PvP. But really could use some love in PvE, they bring nothing to pve that another class doesn't do better.

MithranArkanere · Mar 24, 2011, 09:09 PM // 21:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by drkn

Just a note from a mesmer at heart: leave interrupting to us. Seriously. Rangers should have viable, useful pet builds, they should have useful traps... and no interrupts whatsoever.

All professions have some form of interruption.

Traps should have been for assassins. And assassins should ahve had a way to fade from sight a move around for a short time, to be able to laid the traps without anyone looking.
Rangers should have had some melee attacks, and some summoning skills to bring extra animals and plants in play for a short time, and, of course, the ability to detect and disarm traps.
Also, some expertise and no-attribute attacks should have been turned into "spear or bow" attacks (not ranged, ranged can be used with staves) to give them a few more options.

Brian the Gladiator · Mar 24, 2011, 11:37 PM // 23:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by LifeInfusion

there's flight time. There's also block stances...

Yeah... rangers are so tanky they can sit in the frontline, thus making flight time negligable. Also, their interrupts are so spammable that if not for blocks, the ranger interrupts would be unstopable. Despite the blocks, ranger interrupts are equally as powerful as mesmers and much easier to use.

FoxBat · Mar 24, 2011, 11:55 PM // 23:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by youknowho

Even in this last game update multiple professions saw skill balancing, but the ranger? Not one skill change.

Last update was for PvP, where rangers are fine. And it was mostly nerfs, so I'm not sure what you are expecting.

gremlin · Mar 25, 2011, 12:56 AM // 00:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian the Gladiator

This is patently false. Guild Wars was entirely motivated and inspired by Magic: The Gathering which is a PvP card game. It isn't like WoW which is based off of dungeons and dragons and other PvE role playing games. Sorry, but you are absolutely wrong about your assessment.

A lot of what you say here is true which is why GW2 is NOT a PvP oriented game design like GW1. A-Net realised that they didn't have the ability to manage such a complex system as GW1 so they literally burned the house down and built a new one from scratch.

Well I said I had some issues lol.
Mainly I have a problem that whenever someone asks for an update to pve some pvp player "present company excepted" comes along and rants about how easy pve is and no work is needed and how gw is a pvp game and we should just go away and stop whining.
It is that attitude that lead to my "rant".

I have to say though that gw1 should be considered a pve game in the main if for no other reason than the amount of work that went into creating the pve world.
I recon many more hours of programming went into creating the game world so many in fact compared to the pvp part I cannot imagine it being considered otherwise.
I am biased though because while I find the idea going into battle with other players, the reality is not so good and gets pretty repetitive.

Its true that most of the developer time is given over to pvp and its much like you said they cannot manage gw1 its too complex.
Doesn't help that pvp is an endless pit where no matter how many hours you put into fixing it there will always be more problems created during play.

Saint Scarlet · Mar 25, 2011, 02:52 AM // 02:52

IMO Rangers do need a little bit of working on. They are not half as good as they used to be years ago. Apart from the Pet update to them i cannot remember the last time ranger skills were actually given a boost, seen plenty nerfed over the years(in ones and twos each skill update(when we actually had regular updates)).
They are useful in places but generally they can be outshone by most professions in most places. I barely take my ranger into PvP these days as i prefer necro's or mesmers(and i don't like casters much), even my war gets more PvP playtime than my ranger and wars aren't great.

pingu666 · Mar 25, 2011, 05:17 AM // 05:17

in pvp i can see how there reasonable, but in pve the problem is the best build is pretty much the same as it was back in the propocies time (not including pve or secondary skills)

so barrage, couple of interupts, filler.

nature rituals are just silly cast time now compaired to rit spirits, and rit spirits only effect you positivily (damage/heal/prot/energy etc). if i plop down winnowing then that enemy warrior is going todo more damage.

other proffesions can now spam skills for along time, or reach a equilibirum. (with reasonable builds) imo a ranger cant so much anymore, even running high expertise, the skill costs seem elivated for some skills so you *haveto* run very high expertise and its still a slog/slow sinking feeling.

bow attacks and bows themselves arent that great either

pets are too slow and clumys, the run speed is ok, but they take a age to attack.

inturrupt wise, as a player i get on much better with a ranger, dont know why, they have the added advantage over mesmers of interupting actions rather than some mes skills are only spells.

theres no decent non elite ias either. the pve one is too expensive aswell

personaly id increase pet attack speed but scale down base damage per hit so its about the same as now. look at changing expertise to give a extra rank or something to ranger skills or 1e return on ranger skills, something to make it stronger for ranger skills only, leave it untouched for other proffession skills.

a ias like flail or reduced armour as a drawback.

increase bow damage skills, or stock attack speed/base damage etc. perhaps change critical chance/base damage above rank 12 ?

nature rituals need a big axe taken to cast time (for pve atleast)

for traps to be a viable for normal pve they would need quite a rework i think. in pve you move forward all the time, so laying a trap isnt that useful. even one of the strongest traps http://www.guildwiki.org/Dust_Trap isnt *that* amazing if you only have one go off (also for the cost)

Also the question is how strong should a proffession/build baseline be?
probably the strongest pve proffession/build is rits spirit spamming.

Ranger Jaap · Mar 25, 2011, 01:22 PM // 13:22

Rangers do need some buffing but it's not the interupts those are fine

Leohan · Mar 25, 2011, 04:44 PM // 16:44

Maybe a few skills here or there, but a total set to zero like the Dervish?
My main is a ranger for PvE and Broad Head Arrow + Sloth Shot = 70-80 damage every time, all other skills are just secondary. No other profession can Daze like the ranger can 20+ seconds of daze, volley, epidemic = total shot down of mobs. If your having trouble with interrupt speeds (distracting shot) switch to a short bow weapon, problem solved.
Traps are fine they do not need to be a flash cast. They do enough damage get your attribute points up to 16. As a trapper you should not be in the middle of the fight so having low health is a none issue.

The only thing I can think of I wish was buffed is preparation skills the length is a little short but, it's still manageable. Expertise is there for a reason get your points up and take advantage of it.

In my opinion the ranger isn't going to get any more balanced. Maybe that's the problem Anet as made a few classes overpowered now so the feeling of a ranger is lack luster. I'm up for small skill changes in numbers, but please god no total revamp.

gremlin · Mar 26, 2011, 12:45 AM // 00:45

I came up with a number of ideas over the years for rangers I guess because I like them too much.

I thought that since they created traps they should maybe be able to detect and disable traps.
This is a skill given for one Nightfall mission for some specific mechanical traps.

Bows were ok except that all bows use marksmanship and you have bow attacks in Expertise and Wilderness survival.
It would be nice if there were weapons that used other skill lists I did envision a crossbow that might use expertise to provide some variation and someone suggested a whip for beastmastery.

Also an idea for inscriptions that extended preparations which might be fun.
Nothing ever came of it of course but it was fun to imagine what might have been.

Dearly love to see an Asura battle golem with mechanical repeating crossbows, or a Norn ranger wielding an ultra heavy crossbow.

SpiritThief · Mar 26, 2011, 01:01 AM // 01:01

Make bows fire faster. This is pretty much it. They are all so slow. Any real archer can fire off several a minute.

chris12xu · Mar 26, 2011, 01:25 AM // 01:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian the Gladiator

Yeah... rangers are so tanky they can sit in the frontline, thus making flight time negligable. Also, their interrupts are so spammable that if not for blocks, the ranger interrupts would be unstopable. Despite the blocks, ranger interrupts are equally as powerful as mesmers and much easier to use.

mes rupts > ranger rupts

ranger rupts are more forgiving in the fact that they use little energy and are relatively spammable so if your bad at timing a rupt then they would be a better choice I guess

but for someone who can hit rupts constantly ranger rupts are effected by to many things blocking will lower your chance to hit, also attack speed effects the rupts casting time, and even if your standing right next to the opponent there is still a flight time.

mesmer rupts have nothing to make them fail if you hit the skill it will be rupted unless an anti interrupt skill is used (this will mess up both rangers and mesmers so it cant really be a con to either) also mesmers have fast casting lowering recharge and casting time making their casting time much shorter then a rangers and it makes their skills rather spammable as well. you also don't have to worry about positioning since a spell will never be obstructed or miss its target.

and the biggest advantage of all mesmers and multiple viable AoE rupts that and shut down a mob completely while ranger do have chocking gas its hardly as effecting or as viable as skills like panic tease or cry of frustration

you saying that rangers are just as good at rupting as mesmers is just silly

ranger are utility they were never the best at everything but they did a little of everything and the game itself and become geared more to having classes and role specialize in one thing making the rangers a little outdated

I would like to see them get an update but I dont think they really need a huge overhaul like dervs had just a few fixes

gremlin · Mar 26, 2011, 03:27 AM // 03:27

The difference between Mesmers and Rangers is that a Mesmer is custom designed to interupt the ranger is designed to do a bit of everything including interrupt.

The very description of mesmer in the early days was that they manipulated the raw magical power.
They could increase or decrease its flow shut it off completely or overload the person trying to use it.
It was pretty much all they did in pve before buffs made them good in other roles.

Rangers being jack of all trades easily fell into the role of interrupters on parties because they had a number of other uses that the mesmer wasn't so good at, like daze poison cripple bleeding etc.
While many took mesmer as a secondary class it was the Ranger that did most of the interrupting and condition spreading.

ensoriki · Mar 26, 2011, 03:41 AM // 03:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian the Gladiator

Yeah... rangers are so tanky they can sit in the frontline, thus making flight time negligable. Also, their interrupts are so spammable that if not for blocks, the ranger interrupts would be unstopable. Despite the blocks, ranger interrupts are equally as powerful as mesmers and much easier to use.

What the hell.

Gruff · Mar 26, 2011, 05:17 AM // 05:17

I love playing ranger, looking at the previous updates where classes have either been dumbed down or made overpowered I'd prefer to see rangers left alone.

We certainly don't need a whole class reworking, perhaps just very minor skill tweaks like putting crip shot recharge back to how it had been for so long.

(coming from pvp perspective)